Surpised nobody has started this already. I went to the exhibition today and found the information very interesting and thorough. Enertrag seemed very open and willing to discuss the merits and pitfalls of the site. Turnout wasn't great, does that mean interest/opposition is waning?

Hello Oakworth

Well I dont know what time you went,but when I attended at 6.30 ish there where over 30 people who actually

asked many questions which david linley tried to answer... mainly unsuccessfully..

No Oakworth the opposition is not declining it is growing all the time..

David Linley seems to think 90% will be in favour or wont be bothered to pass an opinion...

Time will tell.. Our message to Enertrag is loud and clear dont waste any more of your time and money pull out now

BWAG

asting more of your time & money pull out now...

BWAG

I was there before 1830. Thought the photo mock ups looked ok.

I went along to this event having found out by accident it was happening. I did not see any advertising it in my village (Hemingby) and wonder if the energy company in question has in fact properly informed locals they were coming (although that chance has now passed).

I walked into Baumber village hall having struggled to park at 7pm when the hall was full of people quizzing the man from the company with what I have to say were perfectly sensible and obviously heartfelt questions. I can see no evidence that interest is waning in this project but to the contrary would like to suggest that locals are more active and vocal than ever. Whether you are for or against wind energy there is no doubt this proposal will impact greatly on people's lives, locally at least, in a negative way. Indeed from what I saw and heard on Tuesday night people from far and wide expressed genuine grievances that should be given some respect not least in open and civilised forums like this.

Unless I am greatly mistaken I do not see BWAG censoring any of the comments (no matter how offbeat) on this forum - the weak presentation at Baumber village hall did not really address anymore than common knowledge and in my humble opinion did not offer locals the billed "consultation" opportunity - I was to be honest left dissapointed and wondering if Enetrag really cares about a true consultation process.

I was there before 1830. Thought the photo mock ups looked ok.

--- oakworth 

mm Oakworth yes if you think 410 feet turbines look smaller than low height trees along the road side entering Wispington, or smaller than telegraph poles or if you fancy scaling Lincoln Cathedral for a view..

so what is your take on our turbine representations on this web site. ?.

or have you bought the enertrag ticket & all is sweetness & light...

The simple fact is unless you go around with your 'eyes wide shut.'.

These turbines will dominate the Wolds and the landscape for over 20 miles.. explain that one away. Oakworth . as Enertrag have tried to do in their; to quote Lindley .. 'subjective way'...

Oh & while I am on the subject of Lindley, not only was he rude and arrogant with me and told me to 'SHUT UP'

I have had reports that he was rude and arrogant to other residents as well... Maybe BWAG should demand a public apology from Enertrag in the local media.... he was asked to apologise to me at the exhibition.....

Good PR I think NOT

Melvin

I was there before 1830. Thought the photo mock ups looked ok.

--- oakworth 

mm Oakworth yes if you think 410 feet turbines look smaller than low height trees along the road side entering Wispington, or smaller than telegraph poles or if you fancy scaling Lincoln Cathedral for a view..

so what is your take on our turbine representations on this web site. ?.

or have you bought the enertrag ticket & all is sweetness & light...

The simple fact is unless you go around with your 'eyes wide shut.'.

These turbines will dominate the Wolds and the landscape for over 20 miles.. explain that one away. Oakworth . as Enertrag have tried to do in their; to quote Lindley .. 'subjective way'...

Oh & while I am on the subject of Lindley, not only was he rude and arrogant with me and told me to 'SHUT UP'

I have had reports that he was rude and arrogant to other residents as well... Maybe BWAG should demand a public apology from Enertrag in the local media.... he was asked to apologise to me at the exhibition.....

Good PR I think NOT

Melvin

--- Melvin(guest) 

regarding enertrag`s meeting, i found it appalling. We arrived at 6.30pm & walked around the display looking at the photos of Baumber that had been taken from quite a distance away, so much so the turbines looked like dots in the distance (not sure if they were to scale). It also showed that we had no rare animals in the area. ( this i know for a fact ). When asking Enertrag`s representive a series of questions, he failed to answer 80% of them, he also made out that they had planning permision already in place. When backed into a corner he proceeded in telling one of the members of BWAG to shut up. In this whole procedure one of the girls was smiling like a cheshire cat, as if we are idiots. Its our lives and homes these people are playing with, my personal opinion is that enertrag are a very unprofessional outfit.

How to make 125 mtr tall Industrial Turbines 'dissapear?' I cant speak about the photographs at the Enertrag Exhibition, as I was'nt there. But I can speak about the photomontage picture produced by Scottish Power for the Wind 'Factory' development proposal at Sempringham Fen. Sempringham Fen is flat and has very few trees, or features viewed from any angle....except for one small line of poplars to the South. And so, by carefully positioning the camera South of that tree line, over a kilometer from the nearest Turbine, they managed to produce a picture, where you can barely see the Turbines at all. You just see the Tops of the Turbines above the trees. This gives the impression that they are not much taller, themselves, than a poplar tree. Correct by the laws of perspective, as the trees are much closer to the viewer than the Turbines. Also, from this angle, the Turbines are 'bunched' as your view point is from the end of the line. Viewed from most other angles, they are spread across the landscape. Having got them conveniently 'bunched' they produce a wide angle photograph, of nothing at all, either side of the Turbines, which has the further effect of, visualy, reducing their height. The photograph is shot at 50mm (which is smaller than the view the eye sees standing at the spot. (Try it yourselves with your own camera) ....Hey presto. They now have a photograph to present to the public.

to be fair, the photos shown on this website's gallery do a similar thing for the opposite reason.

to be fair, the photos shown on this website's gallery do a similar thing for the opposite reason.

--- Laura(guest) 

Laura

The photos on this site are as accurate as they can possibly be, what you see is actually what is coming if Enertrag get their way...

This is a totally rural site with no industrial development at all.. the landscape is free from any obstructions or man made large structures .. the farmer's sheds at baumber , wispington & minting are largely screened by planting.

There is no mitigation that can possibly lessen the impact of 8 x 130mtre turbines, that even at night will have be lit.

These lights will pulse as the blades pass by them...

There will be noise travelling off the blades, which despite Enertrag's assurances will travel.. every energy

company says there will be no noise and every site is producing noise..

Its not such a huge issue where they are set at least 2 km from properties as in most European Countries..

At the exhibition Enertrag glibly said 500 mtrs is sufficient....

They in my view ,do not care about the landscape or the people who live here....

They are interested in one thing only, THAT IS THE SUBSIDIES THAT PRODUCE THEIR PROFIT, which we pay for in higher energy bills..

These and the land base turbines will not reduce conventional power production..This is, in the words of Christopher Booker and others a 'massive scam' ...... in time the great British public will finally wake up to this...

ps there are now 200 action groups throughout the UK fighting wind farm proposals.. are all these people wrong ?

Read the reports on National Wind Watch and the other links and the whole picture becomes clearer...

They are the GREEN RAT .... Enertrag

As chair of a similar action group in Cambridgeshire we knew any exhibition would be a box ticking exercise. To stop the claims of the developer we ensured as many people went as was possible from our 5 very small villages. We so overwhelmed the developers staff and stopped any claim they had for a 'good' exercise. They ran out of comment forms and ran out of a reprint. We also held an exit poll and objectors were asked to confirm their comments with a signature. Our results were over 93% provable against. The developer admitted to 650 visitors.

Now you have to concentrate on the planning process and get publicity, publicity, publicity! Do door to door polling and signatures. It is the only way. It is hard and bloody difficult but worth it.

Best of luck......and concentrate on the planning depts.

Bev Gray CFAG

I don't agree that "the pictures on this site are as accurate as they possibly can be". I have a close relative who lives in one of the houses nearest to the Conisholme wind farm, and the photos that you have are, in my opinion, not representative of what it looks like. Whenever I have been there, even walking directly under the turbines, the noise has been negligable; my reli tells me that at times the noise is louder depending on the wind, but at its worst it is not audible within the house (they have double glazing). She has recently noticed a small amount of flicker at certain times of day now that shadows are almost at their longest. I think the criticisms you make are real, but exaggerated, and perhaps if you weighed in other arguments (our responsibility to mitigate global warming, for instance) you and those campaigning against windfarms might come to a different conclusion. I must say that I welcome an informed debate.

Laura

I too agree that an INFORMED debate is always more desirable than an ill-informed and partisan rant that can easily develop.

To respond to your comments on the photographs posted on this site I would like to offer my take on things as they are my work. I have been a pro photographer for more years than I care to mention and do know my way around a camera or two and associated technologies. I have been carefully making the composite pictures for the BWAG site to enable anyone visiting to see what we might be faced with should these plans go through. I have taken great pains to ensure the accuracy of the turbines mapped to their grid references and set against real backgrounds. Using multiple checking tools, the always reliable Google Earth (where I have every turbine positioned and scaled precisely as a cross-check) and reference images from the helicopter flight earlier this year I can genuinely say they are pretty well accurate.

I don't quite understand your comment about the Conisholme shot not being representative. I took a series of photographs into snow showers on the afternoon of Saturday November 22nd looking to the north east. There is no camera trickery here, no post editing of any kind and yes the sky was that dark overhead - that was the view I had. I then mapped in a properly scaled turbine of the size and design planned for Baumber and even added a green base to give a more realistic aspect. The resultant image IS what an Enertrag turbine would look like next to those of Conisholme - It shows plainly the size comparison to a local and operational wind farm that most of us can relate to, that was the point of the exercise.

You don't have to take my word for it but the pictures are as real as they can be prior to real construction taking place. It is not in anyone's interest to make the camera or computer lie, that way we just weaken our argument and we WOULD inevitably be found out anyway. Great care is always taken to openly offer site visitors the chance to see what we face in a way that is as accurate and realistic as possible. Unfortunately to date Enertrag has decided not to publish any photographic representations as part of their "consultation" process so we have no opportunity to compare. BWAG would welcome images from Enertrag so we could also have the opposing view for everyone to scrutinise in an open and democratic way.

Regards - Windymill

Conisholme..

Thank you for your comments Laura.. However the comments you make about Conisholme do not reflect the full

picture of residents experience... I have documented evidence that there have been and still are, serious noise

and health issues arising from this development... What you say maybe true in your experience, but that is not the experience of every one... Indeed it fits the pattern that is being repeated through out the world....

Please read the links that is what they are there for..

Melvin

ps Thank You Windy Mill for your response and hard work in demonstrating the potential impact if Enertrag get their way....

As chair of a similar action group in Cambridgeshire we knew any exhibition would be a box ticking exercise. To stop the claims of the developer we ensured as many people went as was possible from our 5 very small villages. We so overwhelmed the developers staff and stopped any claim they had for a 'good' exercise. They ran out of comment forms and ran out of a reprint. We also held an exit poll and objectors were asked to confirm their comments with a signature. Our results were over 93% provable against. The developer admitted to 650 visitors.

Now you have to concentrate on the planning process and get publicity, publicity, publicity! Do door to door polling and signatures. It is the only way. It is hard and bloody difficult but worth it.

Best of luck......and concentrate on the planning depts.

Bev Gray CFAG

--- Bev Gray(guest) 

Hi Bev

Thank You for your helpful comments good luck with your campaign too.. I will look up Your site

melvin

......my reli tells me that at times the noise is louder depending on the wind, but at its worst it is not audible within the house (they have double glazing).......

--- Laura(guest) 

Laura

Just let me get this one straight; you are saying the noise levels are OK at Conisholme if you are inside with all the windows and doors closed (I bet that's nice in mid-summer)? It does sound like your relatives have direct experience of a degrading of their quality of life after this wind farm was built. Just imagine what even bigger 130 metre turbines will produce for all of us in Baumber and surrounding villages. It is obvious that small communities across the UK are being sacrificed for a temporarily fashionable, ineffectual and overpriced energy source.

'This is a totally rural site with no industrial development at all.. the landscape is free from any obstructions or man made large structures .. the farmer's sheds at baumber , wispington & minting are largely screened by planting.'

After the exhibition I walked down towards the site to see for myself what the impact will be. I accept that the immediate vicinity has no man made structures, but it's impossible to look across that vista without seeing the sugar beet factory.

'This is a totally rural site with no industrial development at all.. the landscape is free from any obstructions or man made large structures .. the farmer's sheds at baumber , wispington & minting are largely screened by planting.'

After the exhibition I walked down towards the site to see for myself what the impact will be. I accept that the immediate vicinity has no man made structures, but it's impossible to look across that vista without seeing the sugar beet factory.

--- oakworth 

Oakworth the sugar beet factory is one structure .. no where as high as 130 meters it has no impact on the wolds

and to top it all, its is due to be demolished.... If you think these can be justified on this basis, then that is really stretching a point... The factory is also located in a town setting not in open unspolit countryside...

Your point taken to its logical conclusion will mean that if these are built, then it will be ok to have other structures..

how about an industrial park and work shops may be some retail space and so on ,or even a housing estate...

or are you just looking for some odd reasons to keep enertrag happy ?...

Here we have it at long last... the BWEA 'myths' exposed.. they are a self serving trade association masquerading as the deliverer of this Governments policy/targets, in driving forward the Wind Energy Companies Agenda and the subsequent Turbine poliferation what ever the costs/detriment to local communities and landscapes...

They have been actively canvasing and running seminars throughout the Uk, trying to convince Local Authority Councillors and Planners to push though planning applications as fast as possible... Their ideal time scale is 16 weeks....

I know, I attended the Kettering seminar where they proudly announced that it was their 9th and 1,000 delegates have attended... Including representatives from our own Local Authorities...

This site is here to counter balance their justifications and I sincerley hope that those of you who are convinced or even unsure of the merits of Wind Power take a close look at this posting on our welcome page...

I would even be tempted to say that even some of the statements made in response to the BWEA's view points are over cautious, especially those relating to noise and health issues...

Melvin

deligates had attended

Here, here!

It's information that is long overdue and everyday that goes by sees more and more people waking up to what is happening with wind power generation and the REAL concerns of ordinary people that will be affected. It is all very well referring to NIMBYS when you are a long way from being affected but many are beginning to see the true picture from all walks of life and this document is most welcome.

Regards

Normal Bloke